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	<title>Comments on: [[UPDATED]] Pot calls Kettle Black&#8230;gamers give author grief&#8230;</title>
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	<link>http://www.killtenrats.com/2008/01/25/pot-calls-kettle-blackgamers-give-author-grief/</link>
	<description>a group of adventurers on an epic quest</description>
	<pubDate>Sat, 30 Aug 2008 00:51:42 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Ardwulf</title>
		<link>http://www.killtenrats.com/2008/01/25/pot-calls-kettle-blackgamers-give-author-grief/#comment-25661</link>
		<dc:creator>Ardwulf</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Jan 2008 18:55:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.killtenrats.com/2008/01/25/pot-calls-kettle-blackgamers-give-author-grief/#comment-25661</guid>
		<description>It's both unfortunate and embarrassing that the tone of gamer response was so immature, but not surprising.  It's also mighty big of Ms. Lawrence to admit her error and apologize when she found out she'd been misled.  I hope that in the future we (i. e. gamers) can act like adults in situations like this.  It would help if certain news outlets wouldn’t make up lies out of whole cloth, fail to do even cursory research on bogus reports, or serve as propanganda outlets for fanatical religious groups.

To be frank, it's astonishingly naive to think of Fox News as anything but the propaganda wing of the extreme right, as I think even a cursory examination of their “mistakes” would indicate, as would a review of the facts behind the various statements O’Reilly and Hannity, or that guy who says “Barack Hussein Obama” every time he says the man’s name.  This morning one of their hosts called Ted Kennedy’s endorsement of Barack Obama “hate speech,” and the other day a commentator on Hannity’s show compared Obama’s Chicago church to the KKK.  Fair and balanced, my ass.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s both unfortunate and embarrassing that the tone of gamer response was so immature, but not surprising.  It&#8217;s also mighty big of Ms. Lawrence to admit her error and apologize when she found out she&#8217;d been misled.  I hope that in the future we (i. e. gamers) can act like adults in situations like this.  It would help if certain news outlets wouldn’t make up lies out of whole cloth, fail to do even cursory research on bogus reports, or serve as propanganda outlets for fanatical religious groups.</p>
<p>To be frank, it&#8217;s astonishingly naive to think of Fox News as anything but the propaganda wing of the extreme right, as I think even a cursory examination of their “mistakes” would indicate, as would a review of the facts behind the various statements O’Reilly and Hannity, or that guy who says “Barack Hussein Obama” every time he says the man’s name.  This morning one of their hosts called Ted Kennedy’s endorsement of Barack Obama “hate speech,” and the other day a commentator on Hannity’s show compared Obama’s Chicago church to the KKK.  Fair and balanced, my ass.</p>
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		<title>By: yunk</title>
		<link>http://www.killtenrats.com/2008/01/25/pot-calls-kettle-blackgamers-give-author-grief/#comment-25650</link>
		<dc:creator>yunk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Jan 2008 14:15:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.killtenrats.com/2008/01/25/pot-calls-kettle-blackgamers-give-author-grief/#comment-25650</guid>
		<description>I'd be happy with journalistic integrity anywhere. But I've almost given up. I sure don't watch FOX, nor read the NYT, nor listen to NPR or watch PBS (FOX for liberals but you have to pay for it). They are all simply awful. I try not to read the AP esp with the scandals at AP and Reuters the past few years, especially with their photos.

Of course well I can't live in a shell and have to read and keep up, but I find the multitude of blogs out there to be very helpful. Experts in all sorts of fields weigh in on topics, people debunk the media and each other. Sure they are all biased, but in a way it's good to actually see people's bias up front instead of realizing they're only telling me half the story after I already bought it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;d be happy with journalistic integrity anywhere. But I&#8217;ve almost given up. I sure don&#8217;t watch FOX, nor read the NYT, nor listen to NPR or watch PBS (FOX for liberals but you have to pay for it). They are all simply awful. I try not to read the AP esp with the scandals at AP and Reuters the past few years, especially with their photos.</p>
<p>Of course well I can&#8217;t live in a shell and have to read and keep up, but I find the multitude of blogs out there to be very helpful. Experts in all sorts of fields weigh in on topics, people debunk the media and each other. Sure they are all biased, but in a way it&#8217;s good to actually see people&#8217;s bias up front instead of realizing they&#8217;re only telling me half the story after I already bought it.</p>
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		<title>By: Marcus Riedner</title>
		<link>http://www.killtenrats.com/2008/01/25/pot-calls-kettle-blackgamers-give-author-grief/#comment-25637</link>
		<dc:creator>Marcus Riedner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Jan 2008 21:20:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.killtenrats.com/2008/01/25/pot-calls-kettle-blackgamers-give-author-grief/#comment-25637</guid>
		<description>Wait... are we asking for journalistic integrity on Fox?!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wait&#8230; are we asking for journalistic integrity on Fox?!</p>
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		<title>By: A55cl0wn</title>
		<link>http://www.killtenrats.com/2008/01/25/pot-calls-kettle-blackgamers-give-author-grief/#comment-25634</link>
		<dc:creator>A55cl0wn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Jan 2008 17:17:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.killtenrats.com/2008/01/25/pot-calls-kettle-blackgamers-give-author-grief/#comment-25634</guid>
		<description>re: "apology"

...one of the most sincere non-apologies I've ever heard.  She barely admitted that she was wrong, but this was certainly no, "I'm so sorry to the gamer community; I'm sorry for labelling all gamers as 12-year old porn fiends, I'm sorry for the lost sales that BioWare/MS/EA has had and will continue to have because of my idiocy; I'm sorry to all the people out there that worked so hard on an awesome game that did not deserve this blasting and may now be getting misjudged as "smut-peddlars", etc etc"

I think she needs to go back on to the exact same show, same bat-channel, same-bat hour - and issue a formal apology and explanation.  That's the only way that she'll be able to address the same nerfherder-audience that received, believed and acted on her message.  That's the only way to undo the bulk of the damage that she's caused.   ...maybe then, she can get some of her "credibility" back - if she does this, I'll be certain to give her new book a 5-star rating...I'll even read it for the two hours that she watched Mass Effect for. :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>re: &#8220;apology&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8230;one of the most sincere non-apologies I&#8217;ve ever heard.  She barely admitted that she was wrong, but this was certainly no, &#8220;I&#8217;m so sorry to the gamer community; I&#8217;m sorry for labelling all gamers as 12-year old porn fiends, I&#8217;m sorry for the lost sales that BioWare/MS/EA has had and will continue to have because of my idiocy; I&#8217;m sorry to all the people out there that worked so hard on an awesome game that did not deserve this blasting and may now be getting misjudged as &#8220;smut-peddlars&#8221;, etc etc&#8221;</p>
<p>I think she needs to go back on to the exact same show, same bat-channel, same-bat hour - and issue a formal apology and explanation.  That&#8217;s the only way that she&#8217;ll be able to address the same nerfherder-audience that received, believed and acted on her message.  That&#8217;s the only way to undo the bulk of the damage that she&#8217;s caused.   &#8230;maybe then, she can get some of her &#8220;credibility&#8221; back - if she does this, I&#8217;ll be certain to give her new book a 5-star rating&#8230;I&#8217;ll even read it for the two hours that she watched Mass Effect for. :)</p>
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		<title>By: John H.</title>
		<link>http://www.killtenrats.com/2008/01/25/pot-calls-kettle-blackgamers-give-author-grief/#comment-25630</link>
		<dc:creator>John H.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Jan 2008 09:10:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.killtenrats.com/2008/01/25/pot-calls-kettle-blackgamers-give-author-grief/#comment-25630</guid>
		<description>Setting aside the matter of the author....

I've watched Fox News, sometimes inescapably (around here, lots of restaurants play it).  It is no Kool-Aid; it really is biased, and to really sucks, and it really does inestimable harm.  Of course CNN sucks too, but at least they aren't endlessly banging a conservative drum.

-1 to Kill Ten Rats.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Setting aside the matter of the author&#8230;.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve watched Fox News, sometimes inescapably (around here, lots of restaurants play it).  It is no Kool-Aid; it really is biased, and to really sucks, and it really does inestimable harm.  Of course CNN sucks too, but at least they aren&#8217;t endlessly banging a conservative drum.</p>
<p>-1 to Kill Ten Rats.</p>
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		<title>By: Verilazic</title>
		<link>http://www.killtenrats.com/2008/01/25/pot-calls-kettle-blackgamers-give-author-grief/#comment-25629</link>
		<dc:creator>Verilazic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 Jan 2008 22:16:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.killtenrats.com/2008/01/25/pot-calls-kettle-blackgamers-give-author-grief/#comment-25629</guid>
		<description>Well said. And her apology gave me a good laugh. Not at her, but at the zealousness that she described. She deserves respect for finding out that Mass Effect is nothing, and then admitting that she overreacted.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well said. And her apology gave me a good laugh. Not at her, but at the zealousness that she described. She deserves respect for finding out that Mass Effect is nothing, and then admitting that she overreacted.</p>
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		<title>By: Jenn</title>
		<link>http://www.killtenrats.com/2008/01/25/pot-calls-kettle-blackgamers-give-author-grief/#comment-25628</link>
		<dc:creator>Jenn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 Jan 2008 17:09:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.killtenrats.com/2008/01/25/pot-calls-kettle-blackgamers-give-author-grief/#comment-25628</guid>
		<description>So yes Nicodemus and I have spoken privately and I think he's a nice guy too. I hope to turn him on to twitter (my current obsession that happens to scare guys off when I mention it on a first date).

I guess I hit a nerve with the MMORPG crowd, which really wasn't the intention of the post. I stand by red flag #2 because obsession with MMOs, like any other obsession, is unhealthy and I need a man who has balance in his life. I personally feel that first dates are like casual interviews and both parties should want to present their best qualities. The dating process is meant for getting to know someone, that's the whole point. You would never reveal on a first date that you had credit card woes or a gambling addiction, unless of course you're a little on the unstable side. The funny thing about people is that once we get to know each other the less than attractive or quirky qualities sometimes become attractive or endearing. If you think that the person across the table from you wouldn't mind hearing how you reached level 60 in two weeks, then you've probably already established a strong enough bond, making the person more receptive to what you're saying (instead of turned off by it).

@Openedge1 I sent you an email after you commented on my blog, but I guess  my words didn't register or appease you? Let's get real here. I never said "don't get involved with a gamer, as they will be bad news." I would never say that, because I don't believe it to be true. Since my relationship with an obsessive gamer, I have dated at least three other guys who were gamers and I liked them all for different reasons (I think I have a thing for IT guys but that's another post altogether). These guys had balance. They played their MMOs, but didn't feel the need to discuss it on the first date. It gradually came up in conversation later, but it clearly wasn't an obsession for them. 

@Dave I think it would be bad form to cancel a date for a raid, but I wouldn't mind if a guy made arrangements to raid prior to scheduling a date. I'm all about doing my own thing and I need space (because I probably am high maintenance), so I would never want to take that away from a man, but if a guy cancels a date for an MMO then the message he's sending me is that my company is less of a priority. I'm not sure it would make sense for either party to continue dating at that point.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So yes Nicodemus and I have spoken privately and I think he&#8217;s a nice guy too. I hope to turn him on to twitter (my current obsession that happens to scare guys off when I mention it on a first date).</p>
<p>I guess I hit a nerve with the MMORPG crowd, which really wasn&#8217;t the intention of the post. I stand by red flag #2 because obsession with MMOs, like any other obsession, is unhealthy and I need a man who has balance in his life. I personally feel that first dates are like casual interviews and both parties should want to present their best qualities. The dating process is meant for getting to know someone, that&#8217;s the whole point. You would never reveal on a first date that you had credit card woes or a gambling addiction, unless of course you&#8217;re a little on the unstable side. The funny thing about people is that once we get to know each other the less than attractive or quirky qualities sometimes become attractive or endearing. If you think that the person across the table from you wouldn&#8217;t mind hearing how you reached level 60 in two weeks, then you&#8217;ve probably already established a strong enough bond, making the person more receptive to what you&#8217;re saying (instead of turned off by it).</p>
<p>@Openedge1 I sent you an email after you commented on my blog, but I guess  my words didn&#8217;t register or appease you? Let&#8217;s get real here. I never said &#8220;don&#8217;t get involved with a gamer, as they will be bad news.&#8221; I would never say that, because I don&#8217;t believe it to be true. Since my relationship with an obsessive gamer, I have dated at least three other guys who were gamers and I liked them all for different reasons (I think I have a thing for IT guys but that&#8217;s another post altogether). These guys had balance. They played their MMOs, but didn&#8217;t feel the need to discuss it on the first date. It gradually came up in conversation later, but it clearly wasn&#8217;t an obsession for them. </p>
<p>@Dave I think it would be bad form to cancel a date for a raid, but I wouldn&#8217;t mind if a guy made arrangements to raid prior to scheduling a date. I&#8217;m all about doing my own thing and I need space (because I probably am high maintenance), so I would never want to take that away from a man, but if a guy cancels a date for an MMO then the message he&#8217;s sending me is that my company is less of a priority. I&#8217;m not sure it would make sense for either party to continue dating at that point.</p>
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		<title>By: Dave Rickey</title>
		<link>http://www.killtenrats.com/2008/01/25/pot-calls-kettle-blackgamers-give-author-grief/#comment-25627</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave Rickey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 27 Jan 2008 10:45:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.killtenrats.com/2008/01/25/pot-calls-kettle-blackgamers-give-author-grief/#comment-25627</guid>
		<description>Ehhh.  I'll give Jenn the benefit of the doubt, even though I fall firmly in the category of men she's warning women against (fortunately, my wife is just as much of an MMO gamer as I am, which directly tied into how we met).

Being an MMO player is a lifestyle choice.  If you're at all serious about it, there's going to be times you're going to tell your SO "I can't go on our date, we're raiding" or something similar.  If you have *any* sense at all, you're going to keep that to a minimum (real life SO action much more important than ordinary MMO action).

Some women are comparatively high-maintenance, seeing everything else in a man's life as competition for his attention.  I can't say if Jenn is, but she's certainly entitled to offer advice on who she thinks is worth a second date.

--Dave</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ehhh.  I&#8217;ll give Jenn the benefit of the doubt, even though I fall firmly in the category of men she&#8217;s warning women against (fortunately, my wife is just as much of an MMO gamer as I am, which directly tied into how we met).</p>
<p>Being an MMO player is a lifestyle choice.  If you&#8217;re at all serious about it, there&#8217;s going to be times you&#8217;re going to tell your SO &#8220;I can&#8217;t go on our date, we&#8217;re raiding&#8221; or something similar.  If you have *any* sense at all, you&#8217;re going to keep that to a minimum (real life SO action much more important than ordinary MMO action).</p>
<p>Some women are comparatively high-maintenance, seeing everything else in a man&#8217;s life as competition for his attention.  I can&#8217;t say if Jenn is, but she&#8217;s certainly entitled to offer advice on who she thinks is worth a second date.</p>
<p>&#8211;Dave</p>
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