Comments on: Moria Impressions

By: The Gravel Pit | Kill Ten Rats

The Gravel Pit | Kill Ten Rats — Fri, 02 Jan 2009 20:25:51 +0000

[...] was going in such a great direction with Mines of Moria until the Waterworks. Whoever designed the last of the quest chains in [...]

By: wilhelm2451

wilhelm2451 — Wed, 24 Dec 2008 07:37:49 +0000

@Openedge1

After all you have said LOTRO is what then, #4 or #5 when it comes to subscription based MMOs in the US/EU? Not exactly as bad as you have tried to paint it. Or are you asserting that LOTRO would have been better off cramming the channel and having people leave in droves, disgusted with the game? Holding up AoC as such an example of “success” relative to LOTRO rings pretty hollow in my book. BTW, comparing LOTROs NPD numbers with FunComs announced sales doesn’t ring true to me either. Do the NPD numbers show 800K sold, or are you mixing you data?

And I am quite tepid on your XFire trends. I mean if EVE is #8 with ~250K subs, then it does not speak well for WAR, LOTRO, or AoC, since the “all things equal” analysis would say that they’re now all well below the 200K mark. XFire stats are only good for tracking what people who run XFire play. It has always seemed much more focused on shooters, which track more to the PvP fans. The Venn diagram of PvP fans and LOTRO players would show a very small intersection if I were to guess, while it would be much larger for EVE players and PvP fans. Of course, judging where solitaire ranks on XFire, who knows. Of course, those could all be EVE players looking for something to do while mining or patrolling.

But, in the end, as long as LOTRO has enough subs to keep going and continues to improve, I’m happy.

By: Ravious

Ravious — Mon, 22 Dec 2008 20:28:48 +0000

My kinship is secretfireonline.com, and we are dedicated hardcore to being casual. :)

By: H00LiGAN

H00LiGAN — Mon, 22 Dec 2008 17:42:35 +0000

@ Ravious: I am also on Landroval and in dire need of a kinship that well, does something…anything.

By: Openedge1

Openedge1 — Mon, 22 Dec 2008 15:31:34 +0000

@wilhelm2451
if you took WoW out of the picture, LOTRO would be one of the leading US/EU subscription based MMORPGs
This would be interesting if true. But, lets look at more data.
If we look at sales (even though as Rog points out, it cannot be precise, but it can show a trend)
For the year of it’s release, LOTRO sold around 250k boxes according to NPD (this did not track Steam or D2D at the time)…and that is for the YEAR.
Yet, within 1 month, 800k copies of AoC had sold out, same for WAR.
Lets look at maybe…XFire as a another example of “trend”.
The highest LOTRO ever reached on their charts is #14, yet AoC and WAR have both hit #5. Again a”trend”.
As of now WAR is at #15, and LOTRO is #24.
EvE Online is #8…impressive!
So, overall LOTRO has never made a “major” impact sales wise, customer wise, or player wise.
Out of all the blogs that are regulars for MMO’s (Tobold, Keen and Graev, West Karana)…how many discuss LOTRO? Or how often?
The only popularity contest LOTRO wins when you do a search on Google for example is in Gold Sellers.
@Rog
Actually, starting in November, Steam and Direct 2 Drive started to provide their charts “directly”, and is available for news sites (check Kotaku for comparison data from those charts)…so the data is pretty accurate for their numbers.
The fact is the people who “bought” MoM were previous players, and new sell through’s were not rampant.
I know the game is fun for some people, but as I said, I also think we need to look at the clear picture here. LOTRO is not a “top” seller, and may be profitable for Turbine. But, Turbine as a whole has never had a good track record (one closure, and one dogged MMO – DDO), so, they got lucky with a license beloved by many.
It is too bad that it does not do great business like a huge IP should though.
But, as long as you guys are happy eh?

Merry Christmas btw!

By: Ravious

Ravious — Mon, 22 Dec 2008 14:46:27 +0000

@Rog: I think we are all serendipitously on the Landroval server. Feel free to chat up Ravric, if you like.

By: Rog

Rog — Mon, 22 Dec 2008 14:27:03 +0000

@Openedge1: I personally don’t really care what the sale comparisons of these expansions are, but I’m a stickler for accuracy and your trust in NPD’s numbers is IMHO unfounded and misleading.

NPD does not directly track Steam or D2D, they “quantify” based on publicly available info and their own surveys. In other words, they estimate and guess. NPD has been notoriously inaccurate at PC game sales and profits and they announced their attempts to collect digital distribution numbers in an effort to save face. They don’t have any magical bean counter over at NPD, it’s just their business to try to sell marketing numbers to marketing people. I personally would trust their info about as much as I’d trust any biased marketing source. One big huge grain of salt.

You’ve always been looking for metrics, I know it interests you. But there just are no such reliable metrics in this industry. While you could call this stuff the best you can go on, I wouldn’t base an argument on them.

By: Rog

Rog — Mon, 22 Dec 2008 12:20:10 +0000

I’m finding myself more and more intrigued with LOTRO and I’ll probably be venturing into it for the first time (well unless you count the open beta) this week.

The expansion sounds great.

By: Jaggins

Jaggins — Fri, 19 Dec 2008 20:57:42 +0000

I also agree that MoM is really well done. My main problem is a concurrent EVE addiction which has limited my LOTRO playtime! As for the haters, we are very lucky to have so many MMO options these days! I hope you find one that works for you.

By: yunk

yunk — Fri, 19 Dec 2008 17:25:00 +0000

I just realized I spoke about LOTRO in the past tense.