Tanks and Healers

cov[City of Villains] I have mentioned several times my fondness for the City of Villains archetypes, all hybrid damage dealers structured so that you can do fine without a tank and/or healer. It is funny that the end-game content, Lord Recluse’s Strike Force, is exactly a tanker and healer party. Well, tanker and buffer.

The hard part is the last mission, where you fight the entire Freedom Phalanx at once. For that fight, the ideal team is one */Stone Armor Brute and seven Corruptors of various kinds, with Kinetics and Radiation Emission being in the most demand. As many people as possible should have Vengeance. The other archetypes offer burst damage (not useful against 8 Heroes), control (not very useful against Heroes), and pets (which die in a hit or two against Heroes).

Conveniently and sadly, your temporary powers are more important than your character in that fight. Everyone must have a Shivan Shard from Bloody Bay. Several people should have missiles from Warburg. The Shivan Shard pets do far more damage than anyone on your team. The Warburg buffs and debuffs are far more powerful than your own. Your exploiting stacked Vengeance lets you survive while your cracked-out Shivans take out the entire Freedom Phalanx in under a minute.

In a sense, that feels right for villainy. We are using freakish alien/corpse monsters, backed with a missile assault, to take out the heroes of the city while we skulk about and try to stay safe.

: Zubon

7 thoughts on “Tanks and Healers”

  1. That does feel right, though I would argue usefulness. My MM took down the AV at the end of the VG strike force, from full health, *by himself* after the rest of the team bailed. It took 15+ minutes, but there’s something to be said for a build invested almost wholly in secondary & support pools.

  2. Sounds more likely poorly thought out and balanced endgame content than anything else. This back to the core question that has been around for a long time, how do you make a viable endgame that is difficult to conquer with hybrids? The more difficult an encounter is, the more min/maxing is required to defeat it, has been the general rule. It would seem CoV is no exception so far.

  3. T’is somewhat true. To have any chance of defeating the final encounter, most of the team needs to put in the time and grab temporary powers that do most of the work. The problem with these hybrid archtypes is that none of the pure roles, excepting damage, are represented at full strength. Instead, everyone’s got a bit of everything, but that doesn’t work well with high difficulty content. The best analogy I can make from personal experience is the hybrids in WoW. Going into an instance without a Warrior or a proper healer (non-shadow-minded Priest, or restoration Druid) is *hard*. Hybrids aren’t as efficient at any of their available abilities as focused classes are, nor do they have the singular power in one area of a pure class. While it is possible to run many instances with a full group of Paladins, Druids, or Shamen, it’s more of a voluntary extreme challenge than a viable style of gameplay.

  4. Gragh! Don’t talk to me about the LRSF… I love so much about CoH/CoV, love playing a Dominator, the game works so well in letting teams of almost any archetype combination work together, and then… LRSF, bugger off non-Corruptors (apart from the token granite brute). Bah.

    (signed, a bitter Dominator)

  5. How long do you figure until the current “best methodology” for beating LRSF gets nerfed somehow because that’s not how the designers intended for us to do it?

  6. As soon as they can figure out how to block the multi-Vengeance exploit. Stacked Vengeance is one of the big keys, and Vengeance was already nerfed in an attempt to prevent stacking.

    Funny thing is, it was the nerfing that alerted everyone to how powerful stacked Vengeance was. Sure, it was nice before, but we never would have designed half of our characters to take and exploit it. A failed attempt to nerf it led to the massive use of Vengeance.

    A similar thing happened in City of Heroes with Smoke Grenade. It was given a miss chance (yes, the smoke missed its attempt to block their vision). So people started throwing multiple Smoke Grenades. This is how we discovered a decimal place error that made Smoke Grenade ridiculously powerful. Toss a couple at the target and it cannot hit anything. It never occurred to most of us to throw two Smoke Grenades until we were given an incentive to do so. Then they fixed that bug, removed Smoke Grenade stacking, and the power became highly optional.

  7. That’s the biggest problem I have with CoX. The dev team seems intent on making every power “highly optional” instead of every power “highly coveted”. When creating a new build, there are very few choices one has to make, because the majority of available powers are readily known to be less efficient/less effective than the prime powers. It would fine and well if these powers were situational, and not what the player was looking for, but it’s more a matter of either having been nerfed into oblivion or never taken up in the first place.

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