Inigo’s Scenario Guide 1.04

I do not mean to pry, but Arkenor posted some of the 1.04 patch notes for Warhammer Online, along with some commentary.  As it stands there are only two scenarios that reliably launch, at least on my server.  In Tier 3 it is Tor Anroc, and in Tier 4 it is Serpent’s Passage.  This happens because Destruction queues for all the scenarios, and Order queues for one… the one where they feel or definitely have the advantage.  In my guild, we have unofficially embargoed play on Tor Anroc, and so we dutifully queue up for the other 5 scenarios in Tier 3.

With Mythic’s awesome change, Order can still do what they want.  They won’t be randomly forced to play one of the other 5 scenarios, BUT for the long run, it is going to hurt them as a faction.  That is the sound of ultimate suffering.

I think people are jumping the gun with “math” they cannot see.  I do not think it means what you think it means.


EDIT: And, I am jumping the gun with “logic” I cannot see.  I’ll eat the crow to this post.

20 thoughts on “Inigo’s Scenario Guide 1.04”

  1. “This happens because Destruction queues for all the scenarios, and Order queues for one… the one where they feel or definitely have the advantage. ”

    Is that a serious comment? I know on Averheim, I am Order, I always do join all… and still only those scenarios pop up 90% of the time.

  2. Yeah I always join all. You never know if one of the others will pop up. I never saw any reason to only queue one of them.

  3. Well it must be some serious fluke then because Tor Anroc pops, when I join all, at least 5-10 times before anything else pops. In fact, I have come back from a scenario pressed join all, and Tor Anroc will pop within 5 seconds.

    If I press join all, and then unqueue from Tor Anroc… well I have a good half hour to an hour of farming time before anything will pop.

    I hear this same issue throughout my alliance all the time.

    So, if Order is indeed queuing for all… then something must be screwy with how the scenarios are filled up.

  4. Sounds like something screwy, as I have always thought. There is no big Order conspiracy to queue one scenario. We just want to play… like you :)

  5. CoW is Averheim-Order. You don’t need to guess or make things up. You can just ask the other 20ish bloggers if they are all queuing for Tor Anroc.

    Order sees the other side: Destruction almost always gets the bauble, so some Order were boycotting it.

  6. Order accuses Destruction of the same thing. As an order player I could add the additional evidence against destro that most of the time I get into a non-Tor Anroc scenario the match ends early because too few destruction show up.

    However, I think it’s really just a bug with the queuing rather than some server-wide conspiracy.

  7. Interesting… yeah I guess I got spoonfed too much Order=Tor Anroc mentality from my side of the WAR chat…

    If Order thinks the same thing… that’s pretty funny.

  8. I think the Join All is broken. Seriously. I have been doing the most fun part of the game (1-12) over the past few weeks, and EVERYTIME I hit ‘Join ALL’ It is 100% Nordenwatch. I haven’t had anything but that pop on a ‘Join All’. Lately for change I have only been queing for Khaines and Eckrund (Khaines First, then Ekrund) and then Khaines will Pop – but I haven’t had an Eckrund at all. It must have something to do with the first you choose, and in T1 anyway, that must default to Nordenwatch (even though in the HE areas it shows Khaine’s as the first one.. meh, I dunno). Four new characters, 2 Destro, 2 Order, from 1-12 and its only Nordenwatch in T1 with Join All.

    Small sample size, I know, but any and all logic/reason I have gives me the whiffs of a bug. It can’t mathematically be working that way.

    I think they need lockouts on Scenarios – just 5 minutes – meaning that you can’t queue for the same scenario after you do one, forcing some sort of a rotation. Worst case scenario, you have to wait 5 minutes to get into the one you want (which is typically the case anyway).

    Or fix my ‘imaginary’ bug =)

  9. If everybody is doing join all, they might as well make the Scenarios random… which I actually would like. I have not played 2 or 3 of the T3 scenarios at all… despite queuing for all, or queuing all but Tor Anroc.

  10. “This happens because Destruction queues for all the scenarios, and Order queues for one… the one where they feel or definitely have the advantage. ”

    Oh please, i’ve never seen people do this, even in pugs. Everyone hits join all. Silly comments like this are all over the forums, everything is because Order players are not queuing, or queuing for only one. There are posts saying there is some sort of organized conspiracy in t4 where order refuses to queue at all. Whatever.

    If that were the truth, it would not explain why Tor Anroc popped more before they moved the Destro spawn point back. Why would order queue more for a scenario which even the devs admitted was favored towards destruction?

    There’s a hilarious post on f13 from someone on the Goon’s server that makes these claims, then a few posts down the OP admits destro refuses to queue against Order premades, he doesn’t even see how he just blasted both sides, or that maybe he is wrong about knowing other people’s motivations..

    Occam’s Razor people, something’s wrong with how it puts people in scenarios. maybe it is not random. maybe it looks at what location you’re in and weights that one.

  11. yeah I guess I got spoonfed too much Order=Tor Anroc mentality from my side of the WAR chat…

    when sweeping opinions are made about a group of people you can’t actually talk to, usually they are wrong and not even worth considering, let alone repeating.

    On my Order characters people think they know how Destro behaves on that server, an on my Desto characters people think they know how Order behaves on that server. none of it is worth even reading in chat or forums.

  12. Well, honestly, it is easy to see why one might think that is what’s going on. Truth be told there has to be something broken. The last scenario I got dumped into had about 15 seconds left before it ended, and I was only with 2 other people. It’s messed up.

  13. I think what happens is that certain scenarios have more of a tendancy to end quickly than others, while still providing very good EXP and reknown. A good example of this is Tor Anroc vs. other T3 scenarios- Tor Anroc usually does not last more than ten minutes, while Lost Temple of Isha rarely ends before 12 or so minutes have passed. This is more because of the mechanics of the scenarios than anything else, so it can’t really be changed.
    My guess is that the minmaxers who figured out that scenarios are the best EXP also look at which of the individual scenarios is best. They then queue up for that one, and there are enough of them to shove all the “join all” people into their scenario of choice.
    It’s just a theory, but I like it.

  14. I find the first paragraph most entertaining. Funny, the destruction had a massive distance advantage in Tor Anroc, yet on an underpopulated order server (Dark Crag, 3rd largest server in WAR), ONLY Tor Anroc came up in Tier 3.

    Thats not to mention the decisive distance advantage that was in early Mourkain Temple. I dont know how soon it was fixed, Tier 2 for me was LONG ago, but I do recall early on before anyone had mounts, the destruction ALWAYS reached it first. I was convinced that someone had a mount or some other nonsense.

    By the time I had a mount, I had determined every texture corner and terrain block and found the very shortest way to the flag (a result of repeated failures to reach it first and experimentation). I tried it, mounted, still a full second and a half behind destruction Mounts.

    Yet, on a server that was originally LOADED with destro, it was the ONLY one that popped. We got two groups to queue other scenarios, and did PQs, and 3 hours later, NOTHING.

    Two examples where destruction has a decisive advantage and still the order queue it. I am more inclined to blame this on how quickly the games end/how unrestricted they are. No grovord caverns? Probably because its so effing packed, its just a zerg slaughterfest.

    I am quite disappointed to read such a blatant generalization of a mmo faction from a blog I have read for so long.

  15. Many bloggers are misreading the simplistic patch notes and having a cow about the changes to zone capture. So I present to you, what i find to be the completely obvious truth:

    If there are NO GAMES popping for a racial pairing, victory points are awarded. This means, that ZERO games are coming available. If one comes available, the points you gained for them not coming up, are *FORFEIT*. This is NOT the same as ‘wow, theres one game going and its taking me an hour to get to play! They get an hour of victory points!’. It may only be one game, and YOU may not be playing, but PEOPLE are playing it, so no idle-points are awarded.

    If you DONT defend your zones, they deserve to be captured. If you cant muster one group to queue, you deserve to get the zone locked on you. If anything, theyre being ridiculously favorable to underpopulated sides. You mean to tell me, that the side with 8x your numbers is going to take LONGER to lock a zone down because only one group opposes them? YEP!

    AKA: The SAME SYSTEM is still in place, EXACTLY the same as before, except, that if NOBODY opposes a capture in scenarios, it can still be locked down.

    And also, the FLIPSIDE that you failed to mention, is that if we go back to the old system, it is IMPOSSIBLE to take an unopposed zone. If NOBODY ever queues for praag, praag can never be taken? Thats ridiculous. At least, with the patch notes as I have translated them, it can be taken with no resistance.

    So, if it is as I explained in paragraph 1, tip of the hat to Mythic. If it is as you suspect, then yes, the higher population side has the advantage. But it is the same situation with a keep… so why should they be able to zerg keeps but then not capture the zone?

  16. Sorry I just get have been getting sick of reading posts and forums where people make assumptions about other people. In forums of course all the time, but lately in games blogs esp about “oh those people grinding scenarios are this/that” maybe cause it’s an election year I have to hear everyone say how everyone from the other party is stupid, and that passes for political discourse.

  17. No, I pretty much deserved the lashings. Just got blinded by Destruction-fervor. Hopefully I made it through my 200th hour as a blogger, yes? :)

  18. So bah I hit submit. that’s why i have a short fuse lately. I will try to calm down more :)

    Also as convert says, the big problem is t4 is not flipping on any server no matter what Destro does, so something has to change. Either rvr has to be weighted more relative to scenarios than it is or something else. But also if there are no defenders then it’s really not fair to say the enemy can’t make progress.

    However it’s good that the PQ scenarios are weighted so you get more points for defeating it when there are defenders, so I hope it doesn’t change too much.

    It’s all tuning, I suppose there will be more tuning done if they make it too easy. it’s starting to remind me of WoW, where they make the raids too hard and then tune them lower as the players test them in production.

  19. No actually I’m with you Ravious, don’t fold!

    I play Order, and I always hit “Join All”, however I’ve played with other people that claim you get bumped up in the queue if you only queue for the one scenario. I’m fairly sure this is an outright lie.

    Also, there’s the fact that Tor Anroc ends sooner so is faster XP and RP for everyone (well, ok, for order anyway).

    And I’m fairly sure that you’re right, why would Order bother queuing for scenarios they have a chance of losing, when they win Tor Anroc 90% of the time?

    So, with several reasons for the majority of Order to be unsportsmanlike, I’m going to respectfully disagree with others here. Taking the bloggers as a cross-section of the population is going to be woefully inadequate since they seem like a nice bunch. But we’re talking about random MMO tards here people! Who knows what dastardly tricks they get up to.

    In summary, don’t let people choose their scenario maps please.

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